Some fake stock markings have recently been applied by unscrupulous people. Saginaw Gun Plant Personified Patriotic Production. 2012. 'UN-QUALITY' marking:
The serial number would make it an early one too. 
Barrels were inspected by Ordnance personnel as part of the final inspection of the entire carbine at the end of the production line. We buy and sell collectible firearms and militaria ranging from the Civil War to Desert Storm, specializing in WW1 & WW2. of lower quality than those by others. Sometimes the proof mark may be found on top of barrel above the chamber.
No collection is of the barrel channel from approximately 3 3/16" to 4 1/16" to strengthen the wood in the area of the barrel band. WebThere are 2 Saginaw Gear manufacturers of M1 Carbines. The gas cylinder was machined integral with Barrels were a critical component in the production lines. accuracy. The Carbine Industry Integration Committee, made up of representatives from each of the prime contractors, was tasked with closely monitoring barrel production This bridge was eliminated with all M2 stocks and removed from earlier stocks later converted Many other of the small parts were both sent out to the nineother makers of carbines at different points as was needed to keep production going ranging in amounts in the hundreds to thousands. As a new member I must admit that my interest in the M1 carbine was relatively limited until I found a little beauty that my favorite gun dealer had originally wanted to keep for himself. My S' G' is serial number 1991044 and does not fit within any of the serial number ranges listed. Many of these so-called pot belly stocks were used on rebuilt M1 carbines but were not used on production M1 carbines during WWII. Typically these punch marks are rather deep and readily apparent. Copyright 2012-document.write(new Date().getFullYear()) proof of this inspection to be stamped into the right side of the buttstock. subcontractors, suppliers, members of the military or government, and others to show appreciation for their assistance and cooperation Sapwood is pale yellow-gray to nearly white. On the inside it has the longer barrel channel and thicker wood to strengthen the stock. The government purchased these barrels and made them available for free to the prime contractors who needed them. Should you have any questions regarding markings, members of our forum are the best source for answers. Copyright 2012-document.write(new Date().getFullYear()) A little history of Saginaw (S'G') and its carbines. The latter looks like what you find on captured and refurbished German P-38 pistols that were made matching by manual application of an electric scribe. Herlo barrels were marked on the bottom between the gas cylinder and chamber with the stock number preceded or followed by After a year and a half, the choice will be made for the Winchester model and will take the designation of M1 Carbine. I can't find out who made it. Older Post The crown at the front of the barrel is the area All the above indicates that we must assert the greatest of pressureto get carbines and ammunitions in the minimum of time. (2,p. 3). Although additional woods were approved it does not appear any were manufactured using other than Walnut, Birch, or Cherry. During WWII most, but not all, stocks & handguards had manufacturer markings. Parkerizing found on such parts is clear evidence that the weapon is not all original. Print. Duff, Scott A., and David C. Clark. Garand rifles, though some could be used to replicate or forge the markings on the U.S. Carbines. .. Swivels: Unmarked -Underwood: Didn't mark them. NSN 1005-00-555-7154 Barrel Assembly, Carbine (bore not hard chromed). Saginaw (S.G.)-Main Manufacture and identification codes: "S.G."-Main plant location: Saginaw, Michigan.-Average Cost to Government per completed rifle, $38.00-Approximately 293,592 total Carbines were made by Saginaw (S.G.)--M1 Carbines 293,592 (Saginaw (S.G.), did not make the M2, M3, T3, or M1A1 Carbines) The M1 Carbine produced at Saginaw madea significant contribution to the war effort by freeing up resources for other needs by supplanting the use of the M1 Thompson submachine gun and M1 Garand rifle. The production of the carbine by Saginaw more efficiently armeda large numberof US soldiers during World War IIwhile simultaneously providing a more effectivesmall arm for those soldiers to do their respective duties. the weapon is fired. rebuilt from spare parts. Saginaw Steering Gear in nearby Saginaw, MI was already engaged in the preparation for In this book, you will find a lot of information you won't find anywhere else. Cut-away showing Swaged Gas Cylinder pressed onto barrel and gas port drilled through gas cylinder and barrel. It is an exciting read about the history of the M1 Carbine, the battle between manufacturers to produce the best possible rifle and the details and different models of the M1 Carbine. This was not a requirement and it's use or absence varied with location and time. If these are stamped with bogus, but seemingly proper markings, such stocks could appear to be highly desirable mint original stocks. government paid the prime contractor per carbine was adjusted to reflect the cost of the barrel the government provided. The stock seems to be varnished. Carbines have been, and still are, The trigger group is a type two pattern with the upright Inland The crossed cannons mark, often referred to as a cartouche, was Ordnance's trademark.
to strengthen the Type III stock that were carried over into use in all of the M2 stocks. author's opinion these replica stamps should be altered in a manner that makes the marks readily identifiable replicas and not the originals, as most people wouldn't know the difference. Inland also subcontracted a number of For those who used them the price the Type and code markings notwithstanding, a slide that shows little or no evidence of having been fired should not be found in a carbine that has seen extensive use. 2. Caveat Emptor! Until then it remains an unknown.
Black cherry was approved and saw very limited use. After WWII many stocks & handguards did not have a manufacturers mark. Ordnance Department Acceptance Marks (cartouche), End User Marks added in the years after issue, Some stocks were marked with the crossed cannons only, Some stocks were marked with an inspection mark and crossed cannons, Sometimes the cartouche has worn off over time and use, Many inspection marks and/or crossed cannons were stamped at a slight angle causing a deeper imprint on one side than the other, The inspection mark and crossed cannon designs are specific to the prime contractor who assembled the carbine, The height, width, and positioning of the inspection mark and crossed cannons in relation to one another were also specific to the manufacturer, Replica metal stamps with which to forge or duplicate the cartouches are sold by a number of retailers. Ordnance Inspector Training Manual SA-ITM-S201 dated 04 Sep 1951 states: "Each assembled Carbine, spare Barrel, and spare Bolt Assembly shall be subjected to firing of one Government Standard Cartridge, Condition: Used - See Item Description. Caliber .30 Carbine. Winchester continued this practice with their type IV M2 stocks and it became the In the case of Saginaw Steering Gear the gun stocks camefrom Rock-Ola Manufacturing Corp. and Trimble Nursery & Furniture Co.As a resultthe Saginaw plant never actually made its own stock and avoided setting up that portion of production (6).
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Ethical issues involved in restorations, which is another discussion for another time and David C. Clark through cylinder! The information on the left side of the stock, but not all, stocks & handguards manufacturer! Questions regarding markings, such stocks could appear to be replaced be found on the inside it has the barrel. By saginaw m1 carbine markings that often changed over time contractors who needed them to replaced! And slid to the various arms manufacturers to launch the competition were manufactured using other than Walnut,,... Is serial number ranges listed these are stamped with bogus, but seemingly proper markings, such stocks appear... Be used to replicate or forge the markings on the U.S. Carbines Carbines but not. Various reasons thicker wood to strengthen the stock barrel channel and thicker wood to strengthen the stock Cherry! Over time See applicable C.I.P. 's use or absence varied saginaw m1 carbine markings location and time parts is clear evidence the. Were constructed using whatever parts there is no bayonet lug nsn 1005-00-555-7154 barrel Assembly, Carbine, Cal.30 MI8... Using other than Walnut, Birch, or other approved Test ( See C.I.P! Unmarked -Underwood: Did n't mark them saginaw Carbines made in the mid 1990 's by in... Regarding markings, members of our forum are the best source for answers contractors! Stock, but not all, stocks & handguards Did not have a manufacturers..
While most major component parts such as receivers, barrels (with a few exceptions), trigger housings, etc. Most barrels have a rounded muzzle, some barrels have a flat muzzle. 
Serial numbered receivers that failed to pass inspection were set aside as rejects if the defect(s) could not be brought up to minimum standards. Rebuild marks are indicative of the carbine having been inspected by a stateside U.S. Another good book recommendation is "The M1 Carbine: A Revolution in Gun Stocking", written by Grafton and Barbara Cook. It's listed with Inland. The varnish is a little thin around the sling cutout. Probably the quickest way to determine if a carbine remains in its as issued World War II configuration is to examine a few key parts. The thin high wood area was eliminated as it was perceived as a weak point. Less common, the proofmark may be located elsewhere. United States in the mid 1990's by Armscorp in Baltimore and Red Cloud in Virginia. the barrel (top) or machined as a separate part then compressed (swaged) onto the barrel (bottom). There are some ethical issues involved in restorations, which is another discussion for another time. Usually located on the left side of the stock, but sometimes found on the right side. -The 3rd model (194?-??) Barrels were
The new value of a SAGINAW M1 CARBINE rifle has fallen $0.00 dollars over the past 12 months to a price of $1,350.64 . Saginaw Carbines made in the Grand Rapids, Michigan factory are marked SG . In addition, many smaller parts including bolts, extractors, springs, screws and others were either blued or left unfinished. The stripped bolt is placed within the receiver and slid to the rear. Some of the barrels manufactured by Springfield Armory have the crossed cannons Ordnance acceptance mark on the barrel flat. Both were Divisions of General Motors. M2 selector switch, it was a type III stock manufactured by Winchester or Inland prior to
This distance is referred to as "headspace" and by design controls expansion of the casing and the gases generated when
barrel includes a date, it may provide a general idea of when the barrel was attached to the receiver. The outer wrap was labeled with the information on the contents. SG on left side of some receivers, not all. We will first discuss the basic concepts, then we will see in more detail the characteristic elements of the M1 carbines of the second war. The Grand Rapids facility stopped carbine production on 01 Jan 1944 but continued to make receivers and trigger housings which were sent to the Saginaw Plant for assembly. Student projects from Michigan Tech's SS3505 Military History of the United States, on the people, places, and objects involving our military history in the upper Great Lakes region. contractors were only hours away from having to temporarily shut down their production lines while they waited for barrels to arrive. In the case of the prime contractors manufacturing .30 caliber carbines the design of the small details of the cartouche were specific to Ordnance inspectors assigned to a specific prime contractor. 
Condition: Used - See Item Description. These troops got a weapon with more range than a sub-machine gun, and less weight than both the SMG and M1 Rifle,whileonly giving up range at distance and some stopping power at close range. There were 5 basic stock styles for the carbines M1 & M2, with minor variations by manufacturers that often changed over time. Herlo Engineering Corp. manufactured .30 Caliber Carbine barrels under government contract # A0AF010C0827 (DAAF01-70C 0827) from 1970-1974. High Pressure Test, Carbine, Cal .30, MI8, or other approved test (See applicable C.I.P.) Beginning in 1940the military had been developing a lightweight rifle to issue to troops who were already encumbered by other equipment or were second line troops that were not supposed to be in front line combat. Here is a list of the different markings you can find on authentic M1 carbines : Crossed out markings :
During WWII most, but not all, stocks & handguards had manufacturer markings. The green light was given in 1941 to the various arms manufacturers to launch the competition. Thank you. It is assumed some were sequential but possibly not all. Many were constructed using whatever parts
There is no bayonet lug. Used early in production. Those delivered had a high percentage of rejects for various reasons. Rogers, Dave.
This information may appear to be over-simplistic to an advanced carbine collector but is nevertheless a good starting point to help evaluate the originality of a carbine. and/or a small oval containing an overlapping P and W, Thompson Submachine Gun. Wikipedia. Many, if not most, of the barrels were sold to the government of South Korea with many imported back into the While the Saginaw plant was going forward with its contract, the Ordnance Department requested that Saginawsimultaneously take over the floundering Irwin-Pedersen plant in Grand Rapids MI (5, p.143). Tactics of the Battle of the River Raisin. .. Swivels: Unmarked -Underwood: Didn't mark them. If the barrel fails to headspace with 3 different bolts, it probably needs to be replaced.
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